Vreleksá

Tolkien_Freak · Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 12:40 am Post subject: Althist?

Anyone here do anything with alternate history? As often as collaborative projects fail, I was thinking it might be interesting to do a collab althist here (if there's enough interest).

POD is up for choice.

Hemicomputer · Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 610 Location: Calgary, Alberta

I'm not hugely sure what an althist is (alternate version of earth with certain changes to history?) and I have no idea what you mean by POD, but it seems like a cool idea. I'm in.

Tolkien_Freak · Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:08 pm Post subject:

Althists are pretty much that. POD is the 'point of divergence', the first event that happens differently from OTL (our timeline) - generally PODs define the nature of the althist. (For example, a TL with a victorious CSA would likely have the POD of Special Order 191 not getting lost.)

What's always most fun is having minuscule PODs make huge impacts on history.

Kiri · Joined: 13 Jun 2009 Posts: 471 Location: Latvia/Italy

I'm sorry for not answering sooner. This idea intrigues me. You can count me in.

Aeetlrcreejl · Joined: 08 Jun 2007 Posts: 839 Location: Over yonder

OK, as long as the POD is marked by something awesome.
_________________
Iwocwá ĵọṭãsák.
/iwotSwa_H d`Z`Ot`~asa_Hk/
[iocwa_H d`Z`Ot`_h~a_Hk]

Tolkien_Freak · Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:07 pm Post subject:

Sweet, that's 4 people (including me)!

So, what do you guys suggest for a POD (or more than one, if we want it)?

Aeetlrcreejl · Joined: 08 Jun 2007 Posts: 839 Location: Over yonder

Potentials:

Tocharian does not die out.
Anatolian languages live on.
Greece is conquered by Persia.
Tonga and Hawaii form empires.
The Incan Empire is not conquered.
The Ottoman Empire stretches from West Africa to East Asia, and covers a significant portion of Europe.
_________________
Iwocwá ĵọṭãsák.
/iwotSwa_H d`Z`Ot`~asa_Hk/
[iocwa_H d`Z`Ot`_h~a_Hk]

Tolkien_Freak · Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 12:57 am Post subject:

Aeetlrcreejl · Joined: 08 Jun 2007 Posts: 839 Location: Over yonder

Well then, let's kill of Themistocles and conquer away! As soon as the others reply whether they're okay, that is.
_________________
Iwocwá ĵọṭãsák.
/iwotSwa_H d`Z`Ot`~asa_Hk/
[iocwa_H d`Z`Ot`_h~a_Hk]

Kiri · Joined: 13 Jun 2009 Posts: 471 Location: Latvia/Italy

I don't mind the Greece-Persia POD. But what impact would that have? Would we have a way more arabic Europe, considering the Greek culture stuff? And what about the Rome?

Tolkien_Freak · Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:51 am Post subject:

(Note: I think I'm going to change my romanization of Greek names here.)

I bet a lot more ancient Persian influences would be visible in modern Western culture. Arabic, IDK, IDK what would happen to Persia in the 600s AD. (I don't know how much of Persia Rome would end up conquering, that remains to be seen!)

Rome - depends. I know in OTL Themistokles was going to evacuate the Athenians to southern Italy if they lost Salamis, perhaps a replacement would activate a similar plan and transmit at least some Greek culture to Rome.

I suggest we work on the idea taking each century at a time, perhaps less if necessary, starting in, say, 516 BC (having Themistokles die from some disease at age 8 ). Stuff won't change too much before 480, but Athens won't have nearly as powerful a navy and Artemision would probably end differently. (We can assume his nonpresence at Marathon wouldn't affect anything.)

@Aeetl: We might even be able to save the Anatolian languages, somehow I see Persia being more linguistically tolerant than Seleukia and Thrake.

Hemicomputer · Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 610 Location: Calgary, Alberta

I like where this is going. Very Happy

Any chance of us also using the "Incas not getting conquered" POD?

Kiri · Joined: 13 Jun 2009 Posts: 471 Location: Latvia/Italy

Tolkien_Freak · Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 3:37 pm Post subject:

Kiri · Joined: 13 Jun 2009 Posts: 471 Location: Latvia/Italy

In that case, if I'm not mistaken, we would have the whole American history rewritten. I guess what we have then is North and South America filled with 3 big countries until the WWI (at least). And it wouldn't be inhabited with English-speaking people. Would that mean French (or some other language) still being the lingua franka? How about Latvian for the sake of humour? Very Happy

Then what would the English, Spanish and Portuguese people do if they didn't have America to conquer?
Oh, I'm starting to have fun! Wink

Tolkien_Freak · Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:31 pm Post subject:

I bet much of North America north of Mexico would still fall to European colonies, as well as the Caribbean and all of South America east of the Andes (and possibly Central America south of Guatemala). I have no idea which Europeans would end up getting where though.

One of the things I really want to see is an imperial Japan on a scale to rival imperial Britain, with colonies around Australia and NZ, Western North America and East Africa (and maybe pull an India with Italy!).

However, for now let's focus on ERA 1: 516 BC - (say) 450 BC.

Suggestions:
516 BC - Themistokles contracts some disease at age 8 and dies.
490 BC - The Athenians and Plataians defeat the Persians at Marathon.
483 BC - The money generated by the discovery of a new vein of silver at Laurion is distributed to private citizens at the suggestion of the archon Aristides. Athens continues a stalemate with Aigina (which had already sided with the Persians).
480 BC - Suggestions?: What strategy would the Greeks have adopted if Themistokles hadn't been there to suggest fighting at Thermopylai? Would someone else have suggested it, or would they have gone with something entirely different?

Hemicomputer · Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 610 Location: Calgary, Alberta

Tolkien_Freak · Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 2:27 am Post subject:

Aeetlrcreejl · Joined: 08 Jun 2007 Posts: 839 Location: Over yonder

Yes to Japan!
_________________
Iwocwá ĵọṭãsák.
/iwotSwa_H d`Z`Ot`~asa_Hk/
[iocwa_H d`Z`Ot`_h~a_Hk]

Hemicomputer · Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 610 Location: Calgary, Alberta