Vreleksá Forum Index Vreleksá
The Alurhsa Word for Constructed: Creativity in both scripts and languages
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Transcription Challenge: Cthulhu
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Vreleksá Forum Index -> Translations
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
eldin raigmore
Admin


Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1621
Location: SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:01 pm    Post subject: Transcription Challenge: Cthulhu Reply with quote

Write
Cthulhu
in as many scripts as you can.
Natscripts:
Latin: Cthulhu
Greek:
Cyrillic:
Hebrew:
Arabic:
Hangul:
Tamil:

Conscripts:
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
langover94



Joined: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 509
Location: USA

PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know how to pronounce that word...

But if I did I could translate it into Cyrillic.
_________________
Join us at: The Renewed Spirits Forum!
Please join for good discussion. (We need members!)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hemicomputer



Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 610
Location: Calgary, Alberta

PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No one is sure how to pronounce Cthulhu, although "ka-THOO-loo" seems to be most common. It's supposed to be from an alien language that humans cannot possibly pronounce.
_________________
Bakram uso, mi abila, / del us bakrat, dahud bakrita!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
eldin raigmore
Admin


Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1621
Location: SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Greek: χθυλυ , maybe?
Cyrillic:
Хтулу ?
Цтулу ?
Хфулу ?
Should some letters be soft?
Хтулю ?

Anyone for Hebrew? Arabic? Hangul?

Hemicomputer wrote:
No one is sure how to pronounce Cthulhu, although "ka-THOO-loo" seems to be most common. It's supposed to be from an alien language that humans cannot possibly pronounce.
What he said. Even Lovecraft himself didn't always pronounce it the same way. I get the impression it was about 50%-50% whether he'd pronounce it the same way twice in a row.

Also; some people don't spell it the same way every time, although Cthulhu seems to be the preferred spelling.
Do the "h"s mean "aspiration"? or "spirantization"? or "palatalization"? or "nasalization"? Maybe it depends on the language?; aspiration for Greek?, spirantization for English?, palatalization for Portuguese?, nasalization for something else ...? Or maybe it's palatalization for Khmer and nasalization for Portuguese?
And there's a lot of variation about where the h's go.
Essentially, in languages that use the "C", it's something like
C(h)t(h)u(h)l(h)u(h). Usually there are at least two h's and not more than three, and not all of them are equally likely; for instance a final <uh> is uncommon, and both h's around the <l> (that is, <hlh>) are uncommon.
But some European translators say "Ktulu". And again, if a language doesn't use the <C> but does use the <K> and the <h>, the <h>'s can show up various places.
Some "disciples" of Lovecraft have written stories in which his characters have "disciples" of their own; and some of these write "Kutlu".
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
StrangeMagic
Admin


Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 637

PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

가두루 - ka du ru

May be what it is in Korean.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Tolkien_Freak



Joined: 26 Jul 2007
Posts: 1231
Location: in front of my computer. always.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In Japanese it might be カスール (kasuuru) or カツール (katsuuru), depending on what the <h> means.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
eldin raigmore
Admin


Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1621
Location: SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tolkien_Freak wrote:
In Japanese it might be カスール (kasuuru) or カツール (katsuuru), depending on what the <h> means.
StrangeMagic wrote:
가두루 - ka du ru
May be what it is in Korean.
Thanks, T_F and S.M.

langover94 wrote:
I don't know how to pronounce that word...
But if I did I could translate it into Cyrillic.
Care to give it another try?
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
langover94



Joined: 21 Aug 2007
Posts: 509
Location: USA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

langover94 wrote:
I don't know how to pronounce that word...
But if I did I could translate it into Cyrillic.
Quote:
Care to give it another try?


Well, the closest translation that I can think of is:

Ктулху
_________________
Join us at: The Renewed Spirits Forum!
Please join for good discussion. (We need members!)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tolkien_Freak



Joined: 26 Jul 2007
Posts: 1231
Location: in front of my computer. always.

PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tolkien_Freak wrote:
In Japanese it might be カスール (kasuuru) or カツール (katsuuru), depending on what the <h> means.


Razz I'm stupid. It should be either クスール or クツール. (ku instead of ka)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Serali
Admin


Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 929
Location: The Land Of Boingies

PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2008 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well in Käläli it's "Thulu" since there's no such consonant cluster. I'll show you in the script later. S.M beat me to it in Korean. I shall make you pay! MUAHAHAHAHA! Twisted Evil

Beware.........

.........they're......

........coming..........

....to......
.............get......

..................................YOU!

.......BOINGIES!!!!.......

You'd better run now SM! Twisted Evil
_________________


Tobo deu ne lenito sugu? - You kissed a frog?!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
eldin raigmore
Admin


Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1621
Location: SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

langover94 wrote:
Ктулху
Good. Thanks.

Serali wrote:
Well in Käläli it's "Thulu" since there's no such consonant cluster.
If it's the cluster it doesn't have, but it does have the consonants that make the cluster (and just doesn't allow them to come together), then most languages would handle it by inserting an epenthetic something, for instance a vowel, typically either a schwa or a /u/. That is, [kta hu lu] or [ka thu lu] would be much commoner ways to handle this, than /Thulu/.

But maybe you meant it doesn't have the consonant /K/? Obviously you couldn't have meant that, or how would Käläli-speakers pronounce the name of their language?

Just dropping the K is indeed an option; but there are others as well.
For instance:
Could you replace it with a voiced velar plosive? (a [g]?)
A mute velar fricative ([x]) or affricate?
Or a mute palatal plosive or a mute uvular plosive [q]?
(I can't remember how to write a mute velar affricate or a mute palatal plosive. And I may have guessed wrong on the ones I thought I did remember!)

Serali wrote:
I'll show you in the script later.
Look forward to it!
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Serali
Admin


Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 929
Location: The Land Of Boingies

PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 2:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for that one! I changed it to Kathulu. Oh and here it is in the script:

Cthulu In Käläli

It's way to big to put on here so I don't want stretch out the board.


_________________


Tobo deu ne lenito sugu? - You kissed a frog?!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
eldin raigmore
Admin


Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1621
Location: SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Serali wrote:
Thanks for that one! I changed it to Kathulu. Oh and here it is in the script:
Cthulu In Käläli
It's way to big to put on here so I don't want stretch out the board.

I like it.
BTW Cthulu is a proper name; I don't know if "he" comes in plurals.
Maybe it's a family name and we mortal, one-planet, one-universe mayflies who don't live even a whole eon, just didn't know that.
"Dear, are we going to the Cthulus' party tonight?"
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Serali
Admin


Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 929
Location: The Land Of Boingies

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hehehe! Since Cthulu is the name of a made up creature it's a noun so you would use -zë.

Still working on the other one.


_________________


Tobo deu ne lenito sugu? - You kissed a frog?!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
eldin raigmore
Admin


Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1621
Location: SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know whether Käläli has schwas; if it does, you might get
[k@ thu lu] or [k@ Tu lu] (do you have [T]?) instead of [ka thu lu].
And if it doesn't, you might get [ku thu lu], since all the other vowels in the name are /u/.
IMO those are probably likelier strategies cross-linguistically than inserting an epenthetic vowel other than a schwa or a harmonizing vowel.
But what the hey, even dropping one of the segments is attested.

-------------------

This probably belongs on another forum here, or at least another thread, but:

Q: "Dear, are we going to the party at the Cthulus' house in R'lyeh tonight?"

A: "In their dreams, maybe! That bastard Cthulu is dead to me now!"

Q: "What did he say when you were showing your slides about the mountains of Antarctica that made you so mad?"

A: "It's not that. He kept lurking about, and his shadow kept blocking what I was trying to show."

(etc.)
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Serali
Admin


Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 929
Location: The Land Of Boingies

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No Käläli doest have "ə".


_________________


Tobo deu ne lenito sugu? - You kissed a frog?!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
eldin raigmore
Admin


Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1621
Location: SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Fri May 02, 2008 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Serali wrote:
No Käläli doesn't have "ə".
An excellent reason not to use one in transcribing "Cthulhu" to Käläli.
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dusepo



Joined: 12 Feb 2008
Posts: 129

PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Retfon:
kathōlō (ka-thoo-loo) / kotalō (kot-a-loo)
_________________
My Website


Last edited by dusepo on Tue May 06, 2008 10:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hemicomputer



Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 610
Location: Calgary, Alberta

PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Possible transcripts in Holxûs:
Kthüllü
Kuthüllü
Kthülxü
Kuthülxü

The first one is how I would pronounce it, but the others are just as likely.
_________________
Bakram uso, mi abila, / del us bakrat, dahud bakrita!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
eldin raigmore
Admin


Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1621
Location: SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dusepo wrote:
Retfon:
kathōlō (ka-thoo-loo) / kotalō (kot-a-loo)


Hemicomputer wrote:
Possible transcripts in Holxûs:
Kthüllü
Kuthüllü
Kthülxü
Kuthülxü

The first one is how I would pronounce it, but the others are just as likely.
To me, this one
Quote:
Kthülxü
appears likeliest.

--------------------------

But those are pronunciations. (Or romanizations?)
How would you actually write it in Retfon and Holxûs?
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Vreleksá Forum Index -> Translations
Goto page 1, 2  Next
All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
Theme ACID © 2003 par HEDONISM Web Hosting Directory


Start Your Own Video Sharing Site

Free Web Hosting | Free Forum Hosting | FlashWebHost.com | Image Hosting | Photo Gallery | FreeMarriage.com

Powered by PhpBBweb.com, setup your forum now!
For Support, visit Forums.BizHat.com