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Vreleksá The Alurhsa Word for Constructed: Creativity in both scripts and languages
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Aert
Joined: 03 Jul 2008 Posts: 354
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Posted: Sun May 31, 2009 11:18 pm Post subject: TC: The Road Not Taken by Robert Frost |
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Very good poem, although I don't know if I did it justice - my translation is a bit sticky...
Quote: | The Road Not Taken
Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;
Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,
And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.
I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference. |
In (yet again) reworked Aert (I swear I'm almost done changing it around ):
Quote: | Ćráënoų Isc Désgesnýv
Ćýz ćráëná shwin déz Blẃsoų źeẃhil,
É gentsó isc Vé déẃldsnýf scý
É gerár Snývhýd, Vé spyá Teiń
É sųsśen háós rár ćráën fáë vhó fwé Vé sẃld
Rém réó If sovthýz déz émin-Haýẃjoų;
Stelẃ svén gláëoų, inj presóyųm,
É ẃrinoi yéђiń ųrsatzoų injśyé,
Winć If sgeflendog é If soẃéh éminoi;
Eodom léál vénoioų rhiśt
Séminérn Fen yin jonntoų,
É wentð áëhch Hégliś preśóyųm sųђoar
Déz friná isc dé vinyoi bẃérn ђýnt.
Jźẃ, Vé spoaź mbwenthoų ђegcreláë Gléśy!
Eodom ifénoi lón ćrëminá Fen alų ćrëminá,
Vé smhoi jśe amáën Vé cselebohųm.
Vé bųźëeroi léál hųuýinų
Córé Tevýnćyáëvá wágẃ:
Ćýz ćráëná shwin déz Blẃsoų é Vé —
Vé vén crárų ëen sųsnýv,
É léál bẃdëgenndérn fetov. |
I can provide a semi-gloss if anyone wants it.
EDIT: editted to the new letter-forms etc, and other rules of which have just changed...
Last edited by Aert on Wed Jun 03, 2009 1:05 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Aert
Joined: 03 Jul 2008 Posts: 354
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Posted: Sun May 31, 2009 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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(I might post a Spanish translation in a bit as well, I need the practice; anyone here fluent?) |
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Tolkien_Freak

Joined: 26 Jul 2007 Posts: 1231 Location: in front of my computer. always.
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Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:15 am Post subject: |
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Toyature Toya (Emitareaze)
travel-NEG-ATT road (Emitare-INST)
Uriljatu toyamine elhiesoe myanai,
un-converge-PAST road-two.STAT yellow-ATT forest-INESS
Toyatuzigurunulayu ö toyamiljö
travel-POT-NEG-PAST-bad-and 1.STAT road-UNIV.STAT
Ke toyaleru, osaiu voretu ö
thing* travel-person-COP-NEG, long-ADV stand-PAST 1.STAT
Yalunu ke toyamako osayo yaluzigime
look-PAST-and thing* road-PERL** long-SUFFICIENT see-POT-NOM-COMP***
Ka ralate menai ugotayakimai;
3.STAT**** turn-ATT place-ALL below-grow-NOM-INESS
*The word 'ke' (thing) is used when something must be specifically singular.
**Perlative can be used for 'along' (or 'down' in this context)
***Literally 'far enough as my being able to see' (a bit weird in English)
****In this case, 'ke' is 3.sg.
Sadly, can't do much more without major vocab work. Wish I could have done it more poetically, but oh well. |
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Aert
Joined: 03 Jul 2008 Posts: 354
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Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 3:16 am Post subject: |
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Here comes some Spanish!
Quote: | La calle no tomado
Dos caminos seperan en un bosque amarillo,
Y perdón que no podía viajar ambos
Y ser un viajero, largo me quedé
Y miré hacia abajo un tan lejos como podría
Adonde se curva en la maleza;
Luego tomé el otro, tan justo como bonito,
Y teniendo quiezá el derecho mejor
Porque era cubiertido, y quiso uso;
Aúnque en cuanto a eso, el hollando* allí
Ha las gastado en verdad el mismo.
Y ambos esa mañana echaron por igual
En hojas que no pies ha hollado negro.
Ah, ¡guardé el primo para un otro día!
Aúnque sabiendo que caminos tienden a caminos,
Yo dudé que si jamás vaya a volver.
Yo yendo decir esto con un suspiro
En algún sitio de aquí edades y edades:
Dos caminos seperan en un bosque, y yo —
Yo tomé la viajado menor por^,
Y eso ha marcado toda la diferencia. |
* pasando?
^vía?
Kyonides, do you mind looking this over quickly please? Thanks!
(Yay, I now have this poem in 3 languages!)
Last edited by Aert on Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:08 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Tolkien_Freak

Joined: 26 Jul 2007 Posts: 1231 Location: in front of my computer. always.
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Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 4:00 am Post subject: |
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If you want it in natlangs, I can do it in Japanese:
行かなかった道
Ikanakatta Michi
道二つは、黄色の森に分かれた。
両方を行ってまだ一人である事が
できないと思って、長く立って
一つを見た見えるほどに
下草に曲がった場所へ。
Michi futatsu wa, kiiro no mori ni wakareta.
Ryouhou wo itte mada hitori de aru koto ga
Dekinai to omotte, nagaku tatte
Hitotsu wo mita mieru hodo ni
Shitakusa ni magatta basho e.
そして、ほかを見て、同じで美しい、
草があって持ちが無かったから
もっと良い債権があるかもしらなくて、
だけど、それは、そこで行きは
まことに、同じで草臥れた。
Soshite, hoka wo mite, onaji de utsukushii,
Kusa ga atte mochi ga nakatta kara
Motto ii saiken ga aru ka mo shiranakute,
Da kedo, sore wa, soko de iki wa
Makoto ni, onaji de kutabireta.
その朝で、両方は、同じで
どの足も歩かなかった葉にあった。
ああ、第一はほかの日のために残した!
だけど、道が道になると知って、
何時か帰るかと疑った。
Sono asa de, ryouhou wa, onaji de
Dono ashi mo arukanakatta ha ni atta.
Aa, daiichi wa hoka no hi no tame ni nokoshita!
Da kedo, michi ga michi ni naru to shitte,
Itsuka kaeru to utagatta.
ため息とこれを話す
何所かこれから何年か
道二つは森に分かれて、私は-
ほかほど行かなかった道を行った。
そのことは、大変な差になった。
Tameiki to kore wo hanasu
Dokoka korekara nannen ka
Michi futatsu wa mori ni wakatte, watashi wa -
Hoka hodo ikanakatta michi wo itta.
Sono koto wa, taihen na sa ni natta. |
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Aert
Joined: 03 Jul 2008 Posts: 354
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Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:05 am Post subject: |
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Nice!
Would you be able to provide a gloss?
Thanks! |
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achemel
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 556 Location: up for debate
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Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:15 am Post subject: |
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Do they still use the kanji for どこ?Certainly here it seems more poetic to use the kanji, but I hardly see it anywhere really. _________________ I have some small knowledge of:
English, Japanese, Korean, Chinese, Spanish, French
I would like to learn:
Italian, Norwegian, Gaelic
Main conlangs:
ddamachel, tadvaradcel, ra cel, lashel, hemnalg, nomah |
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Tolkien_Freak

Joined: 26 Jul 2007 Posts: 1231 Location: in front of my computer. always.
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Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:42 am Post subject: |
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achemel wrote: | Do they still use the kanji for どこ?Certainly here it seems more poetic to use the kanji, but I hardly see it anywhere really. |
I'm just being weird here, 'cause I like kanji ^_^
Gloss:
Explanations:
MZ - Mizenkei - negative form
RY - ren'youkei - continuative form (can be used for NOM)
CONT - 'continuation', IDK how else to gloss this - kind of like 'and', and yet not (and different from RY)
EXTENT - a weird particle that marks the degree of something
ALSO - a particle that means... 'also'
LOC - 2 different LOCs, ni for place of being, de for place of doing
Ikanakatta Michi
go.MZ-NEG-PAST road
Michi futatsu wa, kiiro no mori ni wakareta.
road two TOPIC, yellow GEN forest LOC split-PAST.
Ryouhou wo itte mada hitori de aru koto ga
both ACC go.CONT still one.person be thing NOM
Dekinai to omotte, nagaku tatte
can-NEG QUOT thing-CONT, long.RY stand-CONT
Hitotsu wo mita mieru hodo ni
one ACC see-PAST, visible limit ALL
Shitakusa ni magatta basho e.
undergrowth LOC turn-PAST place TOWARDS.
Soshite, hoka wo mite, onaji de utsukushii,
then, other ACC see-CONT, same EXTENT beautiful,
Kusa ga atte mochi ga nakatta kara
Grass NOM is-CONT use NOM is.not-PAST because
Motto ii saiken ga aru ka mo shiranakute,
more good claim NOM is INTERROG ALSO know.MZ-NEG-CONT,
Da kedo, sore wa, soko de iki wa
is but, that TOPIC, there LOC go.RY TOPIC
Makoto ni, onaji de kutabireta.
truth LOC, same EXTENT wear-PAST.
Sono asa de, ryouhou wa, onaji de
that morning LOC, both TOPIC, same EXTENT
Dono ashi mo arukanakatta ha ni atta.
which foot ALSO walk.MZ-NEG-PAST leaf LOC is-PAST.
Aa, daiichi wa hoka no hi no tame ni nokoshita!
INTERJ, first TOPIC other GEN day GEN purpose LOC/ALL/something leave-PAST!
Da kedo, michi ga michi ni naru to shitte,
is but, road TOPIC road ALL(I think) become QUOT know-CONT,
Itsuka kaeru to utagatta.
sometime (when-INTERROG) return QUOT doubt-PAST.
Tameiki to kore wo hanasu
sigh COM this ACC tell
Dokoka kore kara nannen ka
somewhere (where-INTERROG) this ABL how.many.years INTERROG
Michi futatsu wa mori ni wakatte, watashi wa -
road two TOPIC forest LOC diverge-CONJ, 1 TOPIC
Hoka hodo ikanakatta michi wo itta.
other limit go.MZ-NEG-PAST road ACC go-PAST.
Sono koto wa, taihen na sa ni natta.
that thing TOPIC, great ATT difference ALL become-PAST.
Gah, it's hard to know how to gloss all those ni's! |
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Aert
Joined: 03 Jul 2008 Posts: 354
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Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 3:03 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, thanks! I'm hoping to take Japanese next year, it looks really neat
There; I now have this poem in English, Spanish, Áërt (and gloss), and Japanese (and Romanji and gloss), and Emitare first stanza  |
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Aeetlrcreejl

Joined: 08 Jun 2007 Posts: 839 Location: Over yonder
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:04 am Post subject: |
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Tolkien_Freak, 日本語で話すか? _________________ Iwocwá ĵọṭãsák.
/iwotSwa_H d`Z`Ot`~asa_Hk/
[iocwa_H d`Z`Ot`_h~a_Hk] |
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Tolkien_Freak

Joined: 26 Jul 2007 Posts: 1231 Location: in front of my computer. always.
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:27 am Post subject: |
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ちょっとだけ。文法をよく知るけど、知る言葉は多くない。かなり辞書を使うの。
本当の話を決してしなかった。 |
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achemel
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 556 Location: up for debate
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:32 am Post subject: |
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日本語ができる人はすごいと思うよ~!この詩を翻訳してくれてありがとう!Has anyone an interest in "Jabberwocky" by Lewis Carroll? I found it in Welsh and Japanese after I read and memorized it in English and thought it was just so cool. (^_^) And difficult to translate, with all the nonsense words. _________________ I have some small knowledge of:
English, Japanese, Korean, Chinese, Spanish, French
I would like to learn:
Italian, Norwegian, Gaelic
Main conlangs:
ddamachel, tadvaradcel, ra cel, lashel, hemnalg, nomah |
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Tolkien_Freak

Joined: 26 Jul 2007 Posts: 1231 Location: in front of my computer. always.
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:38 am Post subject: |
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ありがとうございます~! (IDK how to say 'you're welcome' in Japanese.)
I would love to see that in Japanese, I wonder how they did the nonsense stuff.
Welsh must be crazy. |
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eldin raigmore Admin

Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 1621 Location: SouthEast Michigan
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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I also am interested. _________________ "We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission |
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Aeetlrcreejl

Joined: 08 Jun 2007 Posts: 839 Location: Over yonder
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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I do love Jabberwocky. _________________ Iwocwá ĵọṭãsák.
/iwotSwa_H d`Z`Ot`~asa_Hk/
[iocwa_H d`Z`Ot`_h~a_Hk] |
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achemel
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 556 Location: up for debate
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:06 pm Post subject: |
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Well... I could've sworn I found the links somewhere on omniglot.com but after checking briefly they either aren't actually there or I just didn't look hard enough. However, I found the Japanese version elsewhere, and also a site with over 50 variations in different languages:
Japanese: http://timwerx.net/odds/jab/index.htm
Other: http://www76.pair.com/keithlim/jabberwocky/
Welsh is on there, somewhere.  _________________ I have some small knowledge of:
English, Japanese, Korean, Chinese, Spanish, French
I would like to learn:
Italian, Norwegian, Gaelic
Main conlangs:
ddamachel, tadvaradcel, ra cel, lashel, hemnalg, nomah |
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Tolkien_Freak

Joined: 26 Jul 2007 Posts: 1231 Location: in front of my computer. always.
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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Looks like it uses quite a lot of onomatopoeia, especially in verbs. Quite a few nonsensical kanji combinations too (the one for Jabberwocky itself is the kanji for wrong-tooth-speaking-suffering (but it sounds like Jabberwocky when the on'yomi and kun'yomi are mixed right: jabawaku)). |
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achemel
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 556 Location: up for debate
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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Isn't it great?  _________________ I have some small knowledge of:
English, Japanese, Korean, Chinese, Spanish, French
I would like to learn:
Italian, Norwegian, Gaelic
Main conlangs:
ddamachel, tadvaradcel, ra cel, lashel, hemnalg, nomah |
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Tolkien_Freak

Joined: 26 Jul 2007 Posts: 1231 Location: in front of my computer. always.
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Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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Indeed ^_^
Nonsense poems have to be the absolute hardest to translate, especially stuff like Jabberwocky where the nonsense sounds like it could mean something, it just doesn't. |
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achemel
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 556 Location: up for debate
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Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 2:28 am Post subject: |
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It would be cool if the nonsense words in "Jabberwocky" meant something in someone's conlang, randomly. (^_^) How would they translate it then, I wonder? _________________ I have some small knowledge of:
English, Japanese, Korean, Chinese, Spanish, French
I would like to learn:
Italian, Norwegian, Gaelic
Main conlangs:
ddamachel, tadvaradcel, ra cel, lashel, hemnalg, nomah |
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